Wound up again and 3-4 valve cover testing

[Muffler Mike]

Whoohooo. i finally got to pull the car out of the trailer the other day. (hasnt moved since Fontana) (too many other things in life to take care of or catch up on)
its got me all excited and pumped up again. In between adding in a new drop down addic ladder this weekend (the latest addition on the honeydoo list that will also help make extra room in the garage), I will go through the motor for my usual check up.

BUT i also got to do a test i have been meaning to do since I added some relief hoses I put on at the beginning of last year.
The see through valve cover test. And so far, i think i have made some progress on oil control to the valve cover.
I have one more test to do tonight to verify one more variable I didnt really think of at first, but i did put a video and update on my webpage.
http://mufflermike.com

Hope every one else is getting into it again. Happy Cal-looking

[2stroke]

that thing looks like the window at a peep booth

cool tests mike thanks for the info

[Darren DVKK- K-Roc]

Mike I am curious why you didn't route the lines from the case to the front  of the sump instead of the rear?
Less oil at the front during acceleration.

Great Video!

[jersey joe]

Mike I am curious why you didn't route the lines from the case to the front  of the sump instead of the rear?
Less oil at the front during acceleration.

Great Video!

I just watched the video and was thinking the exact same thing. It's funny that you posted it already Darren. Very informative post. I always enjoy reading Mikes post's. I think I might try this while my engine is apart.

[Muffler Mike]

Mike I am curious why you didn't route the lines from the case to the front  of the sump instead of the rear?
Less oil at the front during acceleration.

Great Video!

If i am not mistaken, the base of my scatter shield gets in the way of the front part of the sump. Im pretty sure thats why, but absolutly, it would be better toward the front of the car.
on Troxells motor, we actually went to the oposite side of the pump because of the bends needed vs distance with the braided hose

[Muffler Mike]

I just watched the video and was thinking the exact same thing. It's funny that you posted it already Darren. Very informative post. I always enjoy reading Mikes post's. I think I might try this while my engine is apart.

Depending on the fittings you use, just watch out for clearance issue to your header. On mine, i had to worry about my wheelie bars. thats why i used cheap fittings and kept things as close as possible the first time around, those forged 90's cost a boat load and im too cheap to spend for exparamenting situations.

[jersey joe]

I have a 4 quart sump and only fill to the bottom line on my dipstick. My crank shouldn't be spinning in oil, but upon acceleration it probably is. I might just add -12 drain lines from my heads. But, i will make a set of valve covers like that to perform my own test with the drain lines and without.

[Bad Bug Two]

If you click here you can see the two #8 hoses that I have draining to the sump on the ¾ side.

If you click here you can see the two #8 hoses on the ½ side and another shot here.

Click here to see how Rocky did his where as he used one #10 hose on each side.

[Muffler Mike]

I have a 4 quart sump and only fill to the bottom line on my dipstick. My crank shouldn't be spinning in oil, but upon acceleration it probably is. I might just add -12 drain lines from my heads. But, i will make a set of valve covers like that to perform my own test with the drain lines and without.

Its not so much the crank is spinning in the oil, but all the oil droplets are slung in one direction and pushes a wall of oil on to the 3-4 side of the case.  simple example of this that i can say is take a water hose on the ground and let it hit the ground but close to a wall. you will see the water tryign to climb the wall. now put sides off the wall and you will get it to climb higher.
Ideally, we need a case that is already as deep as one that has a deep sump on it, problem solved. oil falls down and doesnt have to reachh that 4 inch hole back in the middle.
look at autocraft wet sump. drain for the sump is on the 3-4 side. so it just falls down instead of building up.
I did think about the head drain, but my wheelie bar configuration hinders a free flow shot unless i was to remove the line or disassemble the wheelie bars when i need to take them off. plus i feel the line needs to be pretty big to overcome the head pressure of the existing oil level. (thus Jeff doing 2 number 8's)
If you do that test like mine, absolutly show it. love to see.

[Mike Lawless]

The V8 guys use a scaper and a "kicked out" oil pan to return oil to the sump that is getting slung off the crank

[Muffler Mike]

Well i did another quick test and this is what happened.
I decided to really see the difference. So i pinched off my return lines and proceded to do another rpm run.
the elevation of the oil didnt really get up like i expected, but what it did seem to do is hydraulic the valve cover and lift it off and started spewing oil EVERY WHERE. now i have a mess to clean up.

So maybe its not as good as i thought. have to work on it some more

[IN RANGE inc.]

Mike, Have another beer. It eases the pain of the mess. I do that kind of stuff constantly!

[jfhbuilder]

So, what would be the optimal oil level within the cover at speed.......?

[2stroke]

where you are "venting" the case is below the lifter "shelf" id imagine they would need to be higher, but that creates a whole new set of problems. im doing stage 1 1/2 on mine and scavenging the heads. should be good enuf

[Muffler Mike]

So, what would be the optimal oil level within the cover at speed.......?

ideally, there should only be splashing going on and the rest draining back to the case. the 1-2 side does this.

[Muffler Mike]

where you are "venting" the case is below the lifter "shelf" id imagine they would need to be higher, but that creates a whole new set of problems. im doing stage 1 1/2 on mine and scavenging the heads. should be good enuf

those hoses are set up under the lifter shelf. i am trying to give the oil a place to go instead of being built up to a point that it reaches the lifter/tube drain. I do know it flows just from feel. the hoses heat up just as fast as the sump does, telling me there is flow.
Stage and a half is problem solved all together. just pull the oil out.

[Muffler Mike]

Well i tried a few more times to do some comparison testing. cover keeps lifting and then bounces off an adjuster then a spring, and really starts to move around too much.
So i plane ole gave up after puking a quart of oil.
i will accept what i have thinking that oil control is somewhat working. maybe not ideal, or perfect, but helping in someway.

[David Ward]

Mike,
This is interesting stuff!  I was intrigued at how you ran your lines.  I have considered running a line off the bottom of the 3/4 head or valve cover and back to the sump or case - more or less, like a drain.  Any thoughts on how this would compare to what you've done with your set up?

[jfhbuilder]

Did you happen to take any video of the 1-2 side?   Just curious to SEE the difference.

[Muffler Mike]

Did you happen to take any video of the 1-2 side? Just curious to SEE the difference.

Unfortunatly no. But i have a picture from my first test back in the day. it is only splash from the rockers and drains rather quick. no standing puddle.

[Muffler Mike]

Mike,
This is interesting stuff! I was intrigued at how you ran your lines. I have considered running a line off the bottom of the 3/4 head or valve cover and back to the sump or case - more or less, like a drain. Any thoughts on how this would compare to what you've done with your set up?

I think if the line is big enough, the head drain should work. Unfortunatly, i havent tried that.

[Roman]

Be careful when you drain your head! 

[dangerous]

Can I clarify something Mike?
When you usesd these drains and then pinched them, was there NO vent on the RK cover?
Did the pressure build-up 'lift' the cover and cause your leak?

If that is the case, you may need one drain in the head, AND those tubes?

[Muffler Mike]

Can I clarify something Mike?
When you usesd these drains and then pinched them, was there NO vent on the RK cover?
Did the pressure build-up 'lift' the cover and cause your leak?

If that is the case, you may need one drain in the head, AND those tubes?

On this particluar test, that is my best guess, it seem to want to lift and once that started, it was all over. So i notched the cover gasket trying to get them vented a touch, and it was of no use. i just couldnt keep the cover on after that.
part of my problem was this cover doesnt exactly fit unless i doubled the gasket and then just bearly. (glue two gaskets together) so there was no normal bail on it. i had to use some safetly wire and a spring. Probably the wrong thing to use any ways, but was just looking. Maybe another day, i will try a good cover and put a fitting high and low with some clear tubing to watch the oil level. But it is cool to actually watch the valve train in action.
My normal covers do have breather lines and this is never an issue
i need to find my original tape of the first test and see if i can transfer it to on line video. (i use to do video caputer to get my early pictures)